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Author Topic: 10 IN Deep CO  (Read 7853 times)

Offline Mike Bohannon

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10 IN Deep CO
« on: August 25, 2007, 12:59:38 PM »
I found this 10 IN deep camp oven the other day.  I've never seen one and the price was cheap so it followed me home.   Is it BSR?  It has 10 and Made in USA on the bottom so it's not very old.  Its not ground on the inside but has had some type of finishing, much smoother than my newer Lodges.   This one goes in the 'user' section.  Just right for a whole chicken.  Mike
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Offline Mike Bohannon

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #1 on: August 25, 2007, 01:00:35 PM »
Beside a Lodge 10 IN.
Mike
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Offline Scott Sanders

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #2 on: August 25, 2007, 01:24:32 PM »
Nice find Mike.  Ever since we talked about a 10" deep camp oven made by Lodge for Sportsman's Lodge or Camping Gear or something???  I have been keeping my eye out for one.  Didn't know anyone else made one.  It does look like just the right size for cooking for one or two people.  Not sure if it's BSR, but the lid handle looks like what they have been saying is BSR.  I'll just have to keep looking.

Scott


PS..modify............I think it was Sportsman's Warehouse that had them.  We don't have one in my area.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2007, 03:56:13 PM by sandles2 »
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Offline Tom Penkava

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2007, 08:15:20 PM »
The CO with the tab handle / lifting hole is BSR, dates to early 1960s.
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Offline Mike Bohannon

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #4 on: August 25, 2007, 10:01:47 PM »
Quote
The CO with the tab handle / lifting hole is BSR, dates to early 1960s.

Tom, is BSR the only ones to ever use this tab handle/ lifting hole?  I had remembered reading that they had used it in the early 60s, I just didn't know they were the company that made all of the items with this style handle.  When I see this handle it is definitely BSR.  Am I understanding this correctly? Mike
« Last Edit: August 25, 2007, 10:05:38 PM by mlbohan »
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Offline Tom Penkava

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #5 on: August 25, 2007, 10:54:40 PM »
BSR used that tab handle with the lifting hole only untill they figured out how to cast their regular handle in their new disa machines, as I understand it.
Other companies did also use a tab handle for some items, but I don'd believe they had the lifting hole.
I wouldn't definately class an item as BSR on the handle alone, but the size number and "made in usa" on the bottom of the pot and/or under side of lid does help pin it down to them.
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Offline Mike Bohannon

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #6 on: August 25, 2007, 11:03:00 PM »
Thanks Tom,  I had thought it was BSR but didn't know for sure.  I got it for a user so age was not an issue.  I was just trying to understand the tab handle issue.  I live in Lodge/BSR country so that is by far what I run across the most.  Mike
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Troy_Hockensmith

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #7 on: August 27, 2007, 10:02:39 AM »
Mike,
 THat was the Century line of CO made by BS&R.

 Tom,
 Not doubting your word and I think it can from Dwaynes conversations with BS&R employees but I don't buy the story of the handle thing. IF they didn't know how to do handles, why is it only on the CO? THey didn't seem to have the problem with the other handles. I would like to hear Paul Harveys Rest of the story on this topic.

 
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Offline Dwayne Henson

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #8 on: August 27, 2007, 08:56:23 PM »
Troy,
I have seen CO's, DO's, and sauce pans by BS&R with the tab handle. I don't believe that I've ever seen a skillet lid with a tab handle though. From what I've learned the tab wasn't used very long, that night be one reason the items aren't often seen.  One gentleman told me something along the lines; That after the "Matics" came, It didn't take us long to figure out how to make a tapered handle to swing out of the mold. In the 1987 BS&R Catalog, (It's in the PDF's), they still show a Dutch Oven, and a Sauce Pan with the Tab handle, but the Camp Oven shows a looped handle. I believe in the case of the DO, it's just an old picture being used, as I have newer DO's with looped handles. Now in the case of the sauce pan, they never changed the patterns, and continued using the tab, due to it being such a low volume item. Sort of like the discussions we've had on three-legged camp skillets having gatemarks, but were made through the 1930's.
 I still keep in contact with a couple of these older gentlemen, and if anything new comes up, I'll post it. Part of the problem is many years have past. Remember also, to them, most of the changes that were made, and the daily operations of a foundry, were just ordinary, not anything really memorable. That is why when a questionable piece comes up, that I can't get confirmed, I would rather say no, than yes. I would hate for every unidentified piece of cast iron to be attributed to BS&R.

Scott; Sportsman's Warehouse still has the CO10 Deep. I was up in the Denver Area this past week and checked.

Mike; I have seen one Chinese CO, and numerous Chinese sauce pans, all with tabs.
« Last Edit: August 27, 2007, 09:02:29 PM by ddaa99 »
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Troy_Hockensmith

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2007, 09:24:56 AM »
Dwayne,
 Good post. I would only add that I see a whole lot more CO's with the Tab then anything else. I agree I would hate to see BS&R get the same rap that LOdge gets. If someone doesn't know who made a piece it gets a Lodge Moniker slapped on it.

R/Troy
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Troy_Hockensmith

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #10 on: October 22, 2007, 11:51:48 AM »
http://cgi.ebay.com/Made-in-USA-2-Quart-Stew-Pot-Cast-Iron-Pan-with-Lid_W0QQitemZ130165736493QQihZ003QQcategoryZ976QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Here is a sauce pan with the tab handle. BS&R?  My question is how comes we never see a BS&R regular DO or skillet lid without a tab handle? All examples of those have a normal type handle. If we use the logic of saying they didn't figure out how to do it and went with the tab handles, that means either they never made skillet lids or regular DO's untill they figured out the handle thing or, they did have it figured out and chose to make the tab handles on the CO's and sauce pans. I think the later makes more sense.
 If you go byt the first scenario it indicates that they were making skillet lids or regular DO lids while the Century line of CO's were in production and I find that hard to believe as I place those as 70's and probably 80's.  
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Troy_Hockensmith

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #11 on: October 22, 2007, 11:57:06 AM »
I would add that I just reread Dwaynes post where he said the he had seen regular DO lids with the tab handle. Got any pictures? I don; tthink I have seen one.

Also the catalog shows the TAB handle on a CO from 87. I would not assume they jsut used an old catalog picture. I would bet that is how they were sold.

Interesting.
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Offline Roger Barfield

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #12 on: October 22, 2007, 12:56:07 PM »
Troy, I just want to make sure what you're asking.  Are you asking if they made the regular skillet  and dutch oven lids with the tab handle or without them?
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Troy_Hockensmith

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #13 on: October 22, 2007, 01:21:46 PM »
Roger,
 I'm asking both. Did they make em that way, and if so why don't we see any/many? When did they transition and did they continue to make some pieces w/ the tab while they changed to a regular handle on others.
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Offline Roger Barfield

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #14 on: October 22, 2007, 01:33:18 PM »
I have seen, and have a few skillet and regular dutch oven lids without the tab handles they are the same lid.  Their dutch oven lids have tabs for skillet, but fit the dutch ovens.  I don't know that I've seen any of them with the tab though.  The red mountain line BSR catalog that Dwayne posted in the member area shows the older camp dutch ovens and regular dutch ovens all with the normal style handle, but it's an older design.  I'll look and see what pics I have at home.  
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Offline Roger Barfield

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #15 on: October 22, 2007, 08:08:45 PM »
Troy, I found this pic of an ebay auction, but I think this was a flat bottom kettle and not a dutch oven.
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Offline Dwayne Henson

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #16 on: October 22, 2007, 09:18:51 PM »
Troy
  Unfortunately I lost some photos with the last computer malfunction and I do not have any photos of a DO with a tab lid. I will keep looking. Roger is correct that BS&R used the same lid for DO's and Skillets.

 In The 1987 BS&R catalog: the photo that shows the tab lid is in the "Dutch Oven and Pans" section. That is a DO with the tab lid. Go Two sections down, under "Campware" shows a CO with legs, with a looped handle. This catalog was made 2 years before BS&R's foundry closed and Lodge started casting BS&R items for them. I have BS&R DO's with looped handles that were DESI molded, we all have seen BS&R lids with looped handles on DO's.  That is why I believe that the DO with the tab handle is an old photo they just cut and pasted in for this catalog.

From what I've been told, with the sauce pans, they never changed the patterns since it was a lower volume item. Sorta like those gatemarked, three legged camp skillets, that where sold in the 1930's. Hope this helps with your questions. From my info the only item that continued with a tab handle was the sauce pan.

If I hear anything else I will post. But, like I said previously, the details that we think are important, were just mondane, ordinary happenings of a foundry to them.
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Troy_Hockensmith

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #17 on: October 22, 2007, 10:09:34 PM »
All great answers. I guess it boils down to when did BS&R start making "loop" handles? I'm sure they didn;t rush out and swap all the patterns at once either. I guess even if we nailed it down to the 80's (which would amaze me they didn't figure it out till then when other companies had em throughout the 1800's) can we date them pre and post 80's. That doesn't help much though if you want to know when a tabbed handled CO was made.
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Offline Dwayne Henson

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #18 on: October 22, 2007, 11:09:03 PM »
From my conversations BS&R switched to the DESI molding machines in 1967. I'm not sure if it was early or late in the year, so I'd date the tab handles at 1967,1968 range. Now prior to DESI their lids had looped handles. The automation is what caused the switch in the handles to the tab style. So other than the sauce  pans I think we can date the tab handles to that range.

On the original photos showing the BS&R and Lodge CO side by side notice the differences in sizes. After looking through my notes, Mr. Jones told my one selling point was that the BS&R was advertized as being larger.

Here is a photo of an older DO loop handle, prior to the DESI machines
« Last Edit: October 22, 2007, 11:14:59 PM by ddaa99 »
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Offline Dwayne Henson

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Re: 10 IN Deep CO
« Reply #19 on: October 22, 2007, 11:16:01 PM »
Here is a photo from the forum, Jerry's I believe, same size BS&R DO, but newer looped handle, molded by DESI after 1967.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2007, 11:16:44 PM by ddaa99 »
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