Author Topic: What is ATF?  (Read 12286 times)

Offline Joel Schiff

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Re: What is ATF?
« Reply #20 on: December 20, 2007, 03:37:31 AM »
  Perry, there is so much wonderful info on the WAGS site, that I've often gotten stuck going thru the 'dark side' Discussions, & Ebay forum, not having cadged the time to get into this, or many of the others -- apologize!
 Perry you mention that your little stove is a Charter Oak -- that is really neat -- wish I know how many of these there are around -- tho I'm not much of a toy stove person, would think not a lot!
 Also wouldn't think that Filley made too many varieties of toy stoves -- that is, think that it is likely that the pit bottom on your Filley toy T-pot should fit into the stove lid holes of the toy stove, to which it probably goes.  Both your toy Filley stove, & T-pot would seem to be what I would call 'practice' size -- which the little 'happy homemaker' could actually use.
[NB beware, there is a repro of the toy Filley T-pot, & its fairly good!]
 The other toys look a lot closer to the 'pretend' size(just slightly bigger than the Gris 'Toy #2 sizes') -- these would mostly 'fall thru' the stove's stove lid holes, not sit in/over them.

 In agreeing with your take on the earliness of the toy stove, vs. the features of the other toys, also agree with Ed -- that these other toy forms are most likely Hubley, whose patterns were also later transferred/sold to Greycraft.  They were produced over a lot longer period than the few Filley toys, & sometimes also appear in boxes/boxed sets.
 So despite their appearing on whatever stove in the Toy stove book, don't think that they are original to the stove.
 A lot of people that had toy stoves were not such purists that they wouldn't have anything on their stove unless produced by that toy stove co. -- & a lot of time, those companies themselves never produced the toy 'stove furniture', instead buying it from specialists -- either other toy companies(eg. Hubley, Greycraft) or from 'holloware companies' -- eg. Griswold -- remember, Gris, altho producing both 'pretend', & 'practice' sizes, never to our knowledge made a single toy stove(actually, recall that they may have made a single one, as a gift to one of their exec.s).
« Last Edit: December 20, 2007, 03:40:15 AM by Joel_Schiff »
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Offline C. Perry Rapier

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Re: What is ATF?
« Reply #21 on: December 20, 2007, 07:02:29 AM »
Joel, no my teakettle does not sit down in the eye of the stove, its too big. And you say the GF Filley toy teakettle was copied. Well, based upon what you know, how does mine look? The reason I ask is because I don't know too much about them so if you care to venture an opinion, I'd like to hear it. There's just something about it, maybe its just me, I don't know, would like to hear your opinion though. I'm going to post another picture of the stove showing the Charter Oak.

Offline Ed Allspaugh

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Re: What is ATF?
« Reply #22 on: December 20, 2007, 02:00:33 PM »
Quote
  In agreeing with your take on the earliness of the toy stove, vs. the features of the other toys, also agree with Ed -- that these other toy forms are most likely Hubley, whose patterns were also later transferred/sold to Greycraft.  They were produced over a lot longer period than the few Filley toys, & sometimes also appear in boxes/boxed sets.
 
This is what I said: "Hubley did die cast a part number into their pots and pans for a certain period of years,but the practice was not consistent. Likewise, G.F. Filley of St. Louis gave his stove accessories a "G"number, which accompanied the "Charter Oak" stoves." This is info from the toy stove book under Correct Matching Pots Pans and Accessories.

  I believe most if not all the toy cookware to be GF Filley. Hubley & Greycraft toy cookware do not have bail ears/attachments like in the pic. Perry do all the kettles & DOs have this style bail attachment?  Never seen the loaf pan before. Hubley may have made some fine castings but Greycraft is very grainy. Have not seen these toys of Perrys first hand, tho they look to be very finely cast. The Tea Kettle???? I don't know.
« Last Edit: February 27, 2017, 03:59:14 PM by lillyc »
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Offline Ed Allspaugh

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Re: What is ATF?
« Reply #23 on: December 20, 2007, 02:07:19 PM »
"G" mark
« Last Edit: February 27, 2017, 04:00:36 PM by lillyc »
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Offline Joel Schiff

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Re: What is ATF?
« Reply #24 on: December 25, 2007, 06:23:25 AM »
 The top of the little lid in itself looks lovely, but  Perry, could you possibly post a couple of pics of the Filley T-pot again -- something showing the side, & the 'pit bottom'?
 Am a little antsy about the thickness of the rim of the 'pour spout', which in the legit one is quite thin.
 And how much bigger is the pit-bottom of the T-pot, than the Filley stove lid holes?
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Offline C. Perry Rapier

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Re: What is ATF?
« Reply #25 on: December 25, 2007, 11:10:58 AM »
Joel, when I first seen it, I thought it was brass, but a magnet sticks to it, so that rules that out, yes? And yes, me too thinks the spout looks kind of thick, but I'm thinkin, "they didn't make'em to use" so maybe thicker is not unusual. I will take some more pictures and put them on here for sure. Joel, have you ever seen a fake one of these? And have you ever seen a real one of these? Me, I have only seen the one that I have. My thoughts are that, why would anybody copy this particular item? It does not have the big name recognition that one would assume goes along with copying something, I mean, if you copy something, it would seem to me that you would want to copy something somebody might readily recognize, to increase the chances of them buying your piece of junk.

Offline Joel Schiff

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Re: What is ATF?
« Reply #26 on: December 26, 2007, 02:57:25 AM »
 Perry, have a couple of the legit ones, & have seen one bogus.
 As to why they would want to do it -- altho Filley was not known anywhere near as well as Gris, because of the molds, there has been a significant following for Filley for at least 25 years -- in the year or 2 before Ebay hit the 'middle range' pieces where it most hurt, there were no Filley molds going for less than 125, with a lot of them in the 600 range.  Filley was probably more appreciated on the upper end than Wagner, & the T-pot was right up there -- & remember, the better toy Stoves were regularly going in the 1000s
"Give me Yesterdays Bread, This days Flesh, & last year's Cyder" -- Ben Franklin