Interesting

[C. Perry Rapier]

I was just cleaning a number nine "Sidney Hollow Ware Co. Sidney, O." shallow skillet and its got an "ERIE" ghostmark on it, and it has a cursive or script S on it, along with three numbers that looked like they might have been intended ghosts as well. I think its interesting. Has anybody else see a Sidney Hollow Ware piece with ERIE ghosting before? Just curious.

[C. Perry Rapier]

Here is a picture, maybe you can see the "ERIE" ghostmark.

If you look right above the S in Sidney you can faintly make out the first "E" in "ERIE".

[Mike Bohannon]

Sorry Perry, I'm not able to make out any ghosts.  I'll check at work tomorrow, sometimes I'm able see things on one computer/monitor and not on the other.  Or again maybe it's my discount glasses. :) Mike

[danduhman]

Well I was going to tell you to get your eyes checked but the more i looked the the more i saw it , the e is just inside the heat ring and the s is below and to the right . This is very interesting considering both companys started pretty close to the same time ,this means that sidney holloware might have been cribbing off of griswold from the very beginning?

[Mike Bohannon]

Is this the E in ERIE?

[C. Perry Rapier]

Daniel, I am glad you saw/see that "ERIE". And also, the two companies did not start about the same time. Griswold started around 25 years BEFORE Sidney Hollow Ware. Me, I think that when Griswold went away from the "ERIE" markings, they sold their patterns. If you look at the Blue Book, "Sidney Hollow Ware" was only in business a very short time, and then was acquired by Wagner, and was helped start up by Wagner, but then when Sidney Holllow Ware starting competing too heavily with Wagner, Wagner bought Sidney Hollow Ware, so it even could have been that Wagner got the patterns from Griswold and then gave/sold them to Sidney Hollow Ware. Thats my thinkin of a possibility and I'd say without evidence to the contrary that its a good a possibility as any.

[C. Perry Rapier]

Yes Mike, that is the "E" in "ERIE". How you do dat? And if you look closer, now that you know its there, you can see some of the "R" and then you can see some of the last "E". Thanks for circling that, you and Tom Neitzel, techo boys.  ;)

[maloney108]

What a difference a day makes.  Last night, I couldn't see a thing so I thought you were into some good moonshine, Perry, but this morning, it was clear as a bell!  Maybe it was me that was into the hooch last night!  ;D

Neat picture.

[C. Perry Rapier]

Good morning Jim. Now that I'm sober can someone point it out to me?  ;D

Actually, I have another picture of the same piece, and its more ghost marks. There is a cursive S and some fancy numbers that you can see. The only thing that I can think of is that the S is the cursive S that Sidney Hollow Ware Used on some of their very early pieces. NOW, for this picture I have went through my office and am using a high tech, scientifically developed marking device. I know thatTom Neitzel and Mike Bohannon will be very envious of me but all I can say is "let them gloat".

Oh, I bought this piece from a collection, at an auction, in Sidney, Ohio, about three or four blocks from the old Wagner Foundry. The auction was at the Fairgrounds, back sometime in August 07 I'd say.

[Greg Stahl]

is that

MHS in script?

[livens]

Cool picture :)

I played around with it and managed to get the "E" to stand out more. But Im at work and only have Microsoft Photo Editor, at home my Photoshop may be able to do a better job.

For now I think it may be a fluke, the angle of the "E" looks off to me, and I dont see the other letters.

[livens]

Maybe I spoke too soon. After staring at the picture again I can see the other "E" and maybe an "I". I think having the other "E" would be too much of a coincidence to just be a some random indentations.

[C. Perry Rapier]

is that

MHS in script?

Wow Greg, you got good eyes. At first I thought you was making a joke it being you know, some computer stuff, like PDF or something.

All along I thought it was numbers 624 and then an S at the end, but now I see what you mean, I did not include the first part of the M as anything and was seeing the right part of the M as a six. BUT, I clearly see, now that you have pointed it out that, that these are initials. Wow, I think that IS interesting. Well, it is to me anyway. It may not be to some, so I hope I ain't boring you all too much. So, if they are initials, and I now think they are, I wonder who that person was?

[Will Person]

is that

MHS in script?

Sure looks like it.   Neat.



Will 8-)

[danduhman]

well I stand corrected Perry I ment they started making cookware at close to the same time griswold made hardware ie: hinges and things up until abought 1870 or so acording to most of the stuff I been reading and I cant seem to find any references to any cooking type of impliments prior to that.My reference on sidney hollow ware (the blue book) says tht they were making an assortment of items including kettles and lard presses, stove parts etc. but that they started to make an assortment of hollowware in 1886 which is a 16 year gap .

[C. Perry Rapier]

Daniel, I think Steve Stephens has either the originals or copies of Griswold catalogs/catlog back about 1880, and he says thats about when Griswold started making Hollow Ware. And I did not mean to come across so assertive, I am sorry.  :)

[danduhman]

No harm done Perry I did not I did not take it that you were being assertive . All i have for reference is the red and blue book and some of the old L & W books and steves old cast iron newsletters as reference material I do not have the catalog reprints .