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Author Topic: Pleae help identify unknown Wagner kettle  (Read 2488 times)

Offline Tom Neitzel

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Re: Pleae help identify unknown Wagner kettle
« Reply #20 on: January 30, 2015, 08:10:08 AM »
It really looks like it was sand blasted sometime in the past and has sat a while.  What leads me to say that is if you look at the bail on the kettle, it has the same texture as the rest of the pot.  The only way I have seen that is when the whole thing is blasted with a consistent size grit.  Just my thoughts.
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Offline Mark Zizzi

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Re: Pleae help identify unknown Wagner kettle
« Reply #21 on: January 30, 2015, 08:26:09 AM »
Not Cheryl, but I know she will tell you NO SANDING or plating..that will greatly reduce the value.  Electrolysis is fine and the best way to deal with rust. And yes, you need to keep cast iron oiled or seasoned or rust will take over. Mineral oil is generally used until the piece is seasoned for use. I'm not seeing any rust though..did you or they do anything?..or is this as found? I suppose it could be the pics, but it just doesn't look right, Mike. I'll see if I can find a pic of what it *should* look like...
Edit: something like this....
« Last Edit: January 30, 2015, 09:14:01 AM by mark21221 »
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Offline Mark Zizzi

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Re: Pleae help identify unknown Wagner kettle
« Reply #22 on: January 30, 2015, 08:31:40 AM »
Quote
If any member is in/near Erie PA I'd be willing to show them in person to try to figure out the concern on the surface.

There is such a member in Erie and the perfect guy to examine your pieces. Jim Fuchs. Hopefully he'll join the conversation.  ;)
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Offline Mike Estrich

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Re: Pleae help identify unknown Wagner kettle
« Reply #23 on: January 30, 2015, 08:33:07 AM »
Quote
It really looks like it was sand blasted sometime in the past and has sat a while.  What leads me to say that is if you look at the bail on the kettle, it has the same texture as the rest of the pot.  The only way I have seen that is when the whole thing is blasted with a consistent size grit.  Just my thoughts.
My in-laws and their parents would not have spent the time, energy or money to do that. However, the finishing process in manufacturing these involves that https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=B4S3kYJyUfM (Lodge video). So back to my initial question, if these pieces were not impregnated with oil for 30+ years would it give this look. In other words does the metallurgy require oil through the cooking process or other to maintain its sheen? And could they be easily restored with cleaning and reseasoning? Because if you review the video, the finish looks very similar to the lodge pieces pre-seasoning.
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Offline Mike Estrich

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Re: Pleae help identify unknown Wagner kettle
« Reply #24 on: January 30, 2015, 08:35:20 AM »
Quote
Quote
If any member is in/near Erie PA I'd be willing to show them in person to try to figure out the concern on the surface.

There is such a member in Erie and the perfect guy to examine your pieces. Jim Fuchs. Hopefully he'll join the conversation.  ;)
+1
« Last Edit: January 30, 2015, 08:36:09 AM by hansolo79 »
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Offline Mark Zizzi

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Re: Pleae help identify unknown Wagner kettle
« Reply #25 on: January 30, 2015, 09:22:59 AM »
Mike, the finish on modern Lodge is nothing like the finish on vintage Wagner or Griswold..or even vintage Lodge for that matter. See pics above.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2015, 09:36:09 AM by mark21221 »
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Offline Russell Ware

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Re: Pleae help identify unknown Wagner kettle
« Reply #26 on: January 30, 2015, 09:25:15 AM »
I was thinking Yankee bowl; because of the low sides. Maslin kettles have higher sides, but the tab has me wondering.
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Offline Mark Zizzi

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Re: Pleae help identify unknown Wagner kettle
« Reply #27 on: January 30, 2015, 10:29:51 AM »
For a comparison. Click on the pics to enlarge and you'll see what the concern is.  ;)
« Last Edit: January 30, 2015, 12:04:13 PM by mark21221 »
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Offline Mike Estrich

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Re: Pleae help identify unknown Wagner kettle
« Reply #28 on: January 30, 2015, 01:19:06 PM »
Quote
For a comparison. Click on the pics to enlarge and you'll see what the concern is.  ;)

I think that understand where the concern is... as I become more educated on cast iron (it's like drinking from a fire hose right now) the more I think I'm seeing where the issues are. I've been finding pictures of before, during and after of the refurbishing/re-seasoning processes. I've also tried to find any pictures of sandblasted (found a few) or acid damaged (rare). Currently here's what I've identified  1. Both pieces were not prepped prior to picture being taken and they need cleaned, re-oiled/seasoned...  Both pieces are fairly smooth surfaced and don't resemble any acid damage photos I've seen. If you look at this ebay item http://www.ebay.com/itm/8-GRISWOLD-ERIE-PA-034-ALL-IN-ONE-034-DINNER-SKILLET-P-N-1008-SCARCE-/311246589410?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4877be0de2&nma=true&si=1MHzVGZwIWydf9XwNg4h9relfTo%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557 the surface looks very similar when I compared the photos side by side, not grainy at all. This leads me to believe it's partly a cleaning, oiling & seasoning issue. Here is a link for sandblasting http://www.griswoldandwagner.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?num=1210099387/all-0 and the surface does not look like this at all in person.  2. I need to stop taking photos with my iphone for ebay and forums like this, the coloring is off in the photo vs reality (lighting issue). Your photo was taken outdoors in the daylight, mine was indoors on a table, hoping to get enough sunlight on a cloudy day. The clarity of the photo is also a concern, I can't post the high res photos on here or on ebay due to size limits. I ran into the lighting/clarity issue with a 1911 baseball card I recently had up on eBay. The iPhone couldn't focus properly making the picture not reflect the true color as well as the sharpness of the card.  I will attempt to retake photos over the next few days (weather dependent) with my Sony camera vs the iPhone.

Thank you again for all the help and guidance.
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Offline Mike Estrich

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Re: Pleae help identify unknown Wagner kettle
« Reply #29 on: January 30, 2015, 02:44:48 PM »
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Offline Cheryl Watson

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Re: Pleae help identify unknown Wagner kettle
« Reply #30 on: January 30, 2015, 02:55:56 PM »

Mike, I have speculated possible bead blasting also...  and it is not just us WAGSsters here that are discussing the Gris 3 in 1. Collectors out in Facebookland have begun discussing also and are expressing the same puzzlement that we are conveying... :)

And Mike, kudos to you for coming on over here and listening to us prattle... because some Ebay Sellers would have been very upset and sent a bit of language our way!  :)

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Offline Mark Zizzi

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Re: Pleae help identify unknown Wagner kettle
« Reply #31 on: January 30, 2015, 04:52:31 PM »
Quote: yours was taken outside in the sunlight....
Well no, it was taken indoors earlier today under the fluorescent lights of my basement...with a 3 mega pixel flip phone,  :-[. I really don't think it's the resolution or your iphone. You can clearly see there is iron that is just gone, and it's not coming back. I don't know how else to say it, Mike..I don't think there is a fix for this. Do you know if your in-laws noticed anything different about them when they were found vs when they put them away years ago?  That would be a helpful clue.  And I echo Cheryl's kudos for coming on and trying to figure this all out. So many sellers would not do that.  ;)
« Last Edit: January 30, 2015, 04:55:49 PM by mark21221 »
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Offline Mike Estrich

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Re: Pleae help identify unknown Wagner kettle
« Reply #32 on: January 31, 2015, 09:51:24 PM »
Mark, I was referring to the oval roaster, there's grass in the picture corners. Cheryl and Mark, I try to learn as much as possible, so that I can give my buyers the most honest and precise answers.... I'm curious as well. I appreciate the forums help on this. I want the buyer to be happy with what they're buying.

Back to the Wagner, what do you think the value is on it? Also, I've become hyper sensitive to Griswold pieces and I saw one today... I came across a Griswold 503 gas hot plate today (3 burners) that wasn't in the 5th edition Smith/Wafford Price Guide I took out from the library... any idea the value or price I could get for it if  I was to resell it?
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Offline Mike Estrich

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Re: Pleae help identify unknown Wagner kettle
« Reply #33 on: January 31, 2015, 11:23:54 PM »
Cheryl and Mark, I do have to say that the only thing about the forum that I can see off putting to non WAGS member sellers is the conversation "behind closed doors" with WAGS only eBay access. Which might be why sellers don't post here more or in more positive fashion. There's an obvious solution, join the membership, but for one time sellers, it may not be financially justified. Please don't take offense to this comment, I just wanted to share my observation as a newbie since it was brought up by both of you in your last posts.

I am personally curious what is being said behind closed doors... I hope it's apparent that I'm trying to be up front as possible with these pieces and answer questions to the best of my knowledge.
« Last Edit: February 01, 2015, 03:48:49 AM by hansolo79 »
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Offline Mark Zizzi

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Re: Pleae help identify unknown Wagner kettle
« Reply #34 on: February 01, 2015, 10:16:59 AM »
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Mark, I was referring to the oval roaster,
Oh ok..but did you see the other pics of the handles and the obvious difference?

Quote:I am personally curious what is being said behind closed doors... I hope it's apparent that I'm trying to be up front as possible with these pieces and answer questions to the best of my knowledge.

Well I can tell you it is a very similar discussion as the one here...what might have happened to that all-in-one. And yes, those things are apparent.  ;)
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